STATE OF NEW YORK : COUNTY OF ORANGE TOWN OF NEWBURGH ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X In the Matter of Stewart and Diane Sancton, (67-8-3) R-3 Zone 104 Fern Avenue, Newburgh, New York - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X DATED: September 27, 2018 TIME: 7:00 p.m. PLACE: Town of Newburgh, New York 1496 Route 300 Newburgh, New York 12550 Patrick DeGiorgio, Court Reporter BOARD MEMBERS: DARRIN SCALZO, Chairman PETER OLYMPIA JOHN McKELVEY RICHARD LEVIN JOHN MASTEN ANTHONY MARINO DARRELL BELL (Not Present) ALSO PRESENT: DAVID DONOVAN, ESQ. GERALD CANFIELD SIOBHAN JABLESNIK - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - MICHELLE L. CONERO PMB #276 56 North Plank Road - Suite 1 Newburgh, New York 12550 (845) 451-4163 1 2 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Good evening. I'd like to call the 4 meeting of the Zoning Board of Appeals to 5 order. 6 The first order of business, a public 7 hearing was scheduled for this hearing. The 8 procedure of the board is that the applicant 9 will be called upon to step forward, state 10 their request and explain why it should be 11 granted relief under the code. The board 12 will then ask the applicant any questions it 13 may and then any questions or comments from 14 the public will be entertained. 15 After all the public hearings have 16 been completed, the board may adjourn to 17 confer with counsel regarding any legal 18 questions it may have. 19 The board will then consider the 20 applications in the order heard. The board 21 will try to render a decision this evening, 22 but may take up to 62 days to reach a 23 determination. 24 I would ask if you have cell phones to 1 3 2 please put them on silent or turn them off 3 and when speaking, speak directly into the 4 microphone. We have a stenographer with us 5 this evening that will be recording the 6 meeting minutes. 7 Roll call. We have Darrell Bell who 8 is absent. Richard Levin? 9 MR. LEVIN: 10 Present. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 Anthony Marino? 13 MR. MARINO 14 Here. 15 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 16 John Masten? 17 MR. MASTEN: 18 Here. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 John McKelvey? 21 MR. McKELVEY: 22 Present. 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 Peter Olympia? 1 4 2 MR. OLYMPIA: 3 Here. 4 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 5 Also present David Donovan? 6 MR. DONOVAN: 7 Here. 8 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 9 Siobhan Jablesnik? 10 MS. JABLESNIK: 11 Here. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 Gerry Canfield? 14 MR. CANFIELD: 15 Here. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 And I am Darrin Scalzo, the chairman. 18 If we could started off with the Pledge of 19 Allegiance. 20 21 (Pledge of Allegiance) 22 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 Before we start the formal portion of 1 5 2 the meeting, I would just like to recognize 3 that we had a retirement. Betty Genneralli, 4 our Zoning Board of Appeals secretary 5 retired. I just want to thank her for her 6 years of service and the assistance that she 7 provided to us all. Thank you Betty. 8 Our first applicant this evening is 9 Stewart and Diane Sancton. 104 Fern Avenue, 10 Newburgh. (67-8-3) R-3 Zone. 11 Variance. Area variances for (A) 12 accessory buildings shall be 5 feet from a 13 side yard property line to replace an 14 accessory building built without a building 15 permit and (B) area variances for the 16 minimum rear yard setback, the minimum one 17 side yard setback, the minimum combined side 18 yard setback and increasing the degree of 19 non-conformity of the front yard setback 20 (with the pool) to replace a pool and pool 21 deck built without a building permit on the 22 premises. 23 The public hearing notices for all of 24 applications being heard this evening were 1 6 2 published in the Mid-Hudson Times on? 3 MS. JABLESNIK: 4 Wednesday, September 19th. 5 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 6 Thank you. And the Orange County Post 7 on? 8 MS. JABLESNIK: 9 Friday, September 21st. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 And for this first applicant the 12 amount of mailings that were sent out? 13 MS. JABLESNIK: 14 44. 15 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 16 All mailings, publications, postings 17 are in order? 18 MS. JABLESNIK: 19 Yes. 20 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 21 Thank you. Do we have anyone 22 representing? Please step forward. I might 23 add that all of the Zoning Board of Appeals 24 members have visited the site so we are all 1 7 2 personally familiar with what is going on. 3 MR. SANCTON: 4 I'm Stew Sancton. Chairman, members, 5 thank you for taking my request for area 6 variances. Since you've all been there, you 7 have seen and know about the damage from the 8 storm on May 15th. I know you guys turned 9 down the permit because there were, I guess, 10 no permits issued by the previous owner of 11 the house and I have no control over what he 12 did and didn't apply for, but I'm caught 13 kind of in the middle. 14 MR. McKELVEY: 15 You have to rectify it. 16 MR. SANCTON: 17 Unfortunately even though I submitted 18 a survey plan of the property two months 19 prior to when I bought the house and it 20 shows all those things on there, it went 21 through the title company which I assume 22 it's their job to check on these things, I 23 don't know how it just went, but it wasn't a 24 method that would protect me in this 1 8 2 situation. Here I am requesting so we can 3 get our backyard and everything back 4 together and our lives a little bit more 5 organized. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 Okay. Thank you very much. 8 MR. SANCTON: 9 Sure. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 Stay right up here. We are going to 12 probably ask you questions and it's easier 13 if you are standing in front of the 14 microphone. As I say, we all saw the site 15 today. I saw the fence is also damaged as 16 well. I'm going to turn to the board. I 17 don't have any comments myself. Mr. 18 Olympia? 19 MR. OLYMPIA: 20 Do you plan on replacing the shed 21 that's on the property? 22 MR. SANCTON: 23 Yes. That's part of the request. I 24 believe that's the building area variance A 1 9 2 on the listing. That's all part of it. 3 MR. OLYMPIA: 4 I'm assuming you have a mortgage on 5 the property? 6 MR. SANCTON: 7 Yes. 8 MR. OLYMPIA: 9 Title search? 10 MR. SANCTON: 11 No. 12 MR. OLYMPIA: 13 That's amazing. 14 MR. McKELVEY: 15 Are you going to build a new shed or 16 just move that one? 17 MR. SANCTON: 18 Build a new shed. 19 MR. LEVIN: 20 How long have you lived there? 21 MR. SANCTON: 22 I bought the house in '92, so it's 26 23 years this November. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 10 2 Mr. Masten? 3 MR. MASTEN: 4 I have nothing. 5 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 6 Mr. Marino? 7 MR. MARINO: 8 The question I have, the shed was 9 there when you bought it? 10 MR. SANCTON: 11 Yes. 12 MR. MARINO: 13 And pool and deck? 14 MR. SANCTON: 15 Yes. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 When you go to rebuild the shed, I'm 18 assuming you will not have it 2/10th closer 19 to the property line, you will have to 20 maintain the rear of it, you couldn't 21 possibly fit -- (interrupted) 22 MR. SANCTON: 23 Whatever -- to be moved to comply is 24 not a problem. 1 11 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 I believe it was five foot for an 4 accessory structure? 5 MR. SANCTON: 6 Yes. 7 MR. McKELVEY: 8 Yes. 9 MR. CANFIELD: 10 Correct. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 At this time I'm going to open the 13 meeting up to any members of the public that 14 may want to speak about this application. 15 Hearing none, I'll give one more opportunity 16 for the board. 17 MR. OLYMPIA: 18 I'm fine. 19 MR. LEVIN: 20 You will be glad to get that mess off 21 the property. 22 MR. SANCTON: 23 Yes, I will. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 12 2 At this point if I could hear a motion 3 to close the public hearing. 4 MR. MASTEN: 5 I'll make a motion. 6 MR. MARINO: 7 Second. 8 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 9 We have a motion by Mr. Masten, a 10 second by Mr. Marino. Roll call. Mr. 11 Levin? 12 MR. LEVIN: 13 Yes. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 Mr. Marino? 16 MR. MARINO: 17 Yes. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 Mr. Masten? 20 MR. MASTEN: 21 Yes. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Mr. McKelvey? 24 MR. McKELVEY: 1 13 2 Yes. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 Mr. Olympia? 5 MR. OLYMPIA: 6 Yes. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 And I am a yes as well. We will try to 9 render a decision this evening. 10 (Time noted 7:15 p.m.) 11 12 (Decision: Time Resumed 8:25 p.m.) 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Okay. I'm calling the meeting back to 15 order. We will attempt to make 16 determinations for the applicants heard this 17 evening. All of the applicants this evening 18 are type 2 actions under SEQRA, so we are 19 with regards to applicant number 1, which is 20 Stewart and Diane Sancton, 104 Fern Avenue, 21 Newburgh. (67-8-3) R-3 Zone. 22 Area variances for (A) accessory 23 buildings shall be 5 feet from a side yard 24 property line to replace an accessory 1 14 2 building built without a building permit and 3 (B) area variances for the minimum rear yard 4 setback, the minimum one side yard setback, 5 the minimum combined side yard setback and 6 increasing the degree of non-conformity of 7 the front yard setback (with the pool) to 8 replace a pool and pool deck built without a 9 building permit on the premises. 10 Do we have any discussion on this 11 application? 12 MR. McKELVEY: 13 I would like to get his yard cleaned 14 up. 15 MR. LEVIN: 16 Yes. 17 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 18 Okay. So we will proceed with the 19 area variance questions. The area variance 20 criteria and discuss the five factors that 21 we will be weighing. The first one being 22 whether or not the benefit can be achieved 23 by other means feasible to the applicant. 24 The only means feasible to the applicant is 1 15 2 to not do it. The second, is there's an 3 undesirable change in the neighborhood 4 character or the detriment of nearby 5 neighborhood properties? I don't believe 6 so. 7 MR. McKELVEY: 8 No. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 The third one is whether the request 11 is substantial and I would say no because 12 it's going to replace in kind with what was 13 damaged. The fourth, whether the request 14 will have adverse physical or environmental 15 affects. I don't believe so. 16 MR. McKELVEY: 17 No. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 And the fifth, whether the alleged 20 difficulty is self-created. This is 21 relevant, but not determinative. 22 MR. OLYMPIA: 23 No. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 16 2 At this point any further discussion? 3 It doesn't appear that way. Perhaps I can 4 hear a motion for approval. 5 MR. McKELVEY: 6 I'll make a motion. 7 MR. LEVIN: 8 I'll second it. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 Motion from Mr. McKelvey, a second 11 from Mr. Masten. 12 MR. LEVIN: 13 The motion to approve with the taking 14 the shed out. A motion to approve removing 15 the shed or am I on the wrong one? 16 MR. DONOVAN: 17 Are you saying making the shed 18 compliant? 19 MR. LEVIN: 20 No, I'm sorry. 21 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 22 He's going to rebuild the shed. He's 23 going to be constructing a new shed. 24 MR. LEVIN: 1 17 2 Fine. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 New shed within the required side yard 5 setbacks according to town code. 6 MR. CANFIELD: 7 Five feet from the property line. 8 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 9 Yes, five feet from the property line. 10 MR. CANFIELD: 11 With that being said that removes the 12 need for the variance. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Okay. So I have a motion and a 15 second. Roll call. Mr. Levin? 16 MR. LEVIN: 17 Yes. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 Mr. Marino? 20 MR. MARINO: 21 Yes. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Mr. Masten? 24 MR. MASTEN: 1 18 2 Yes. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 Mr. McKelvey? 5 MR. McKELVEY: 6 Yes. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Mr. Olympia? 9 MR. OLYMPIA: 10 Yes. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 And I vote yes as well. The motion is 13 carried. The application is approved. 14 Thank you. 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 1 19 2 STATE OF NEW YORK ) 3 ) ss: 4 COUNTY OF ORANGE ) 5 6 7 I, PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO, a Shorthand 8 Reporter and Notary Public within and for 9 the State of New York, do hereby certify 10 that the foregoing is a true and accurate 11 record of the minutes having been 12 stenographically recorded by me and 13 transcribed under my supervision to the best 14 of my knowledge and belief. 15 16 17 18 19 X______________________________ 20 PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO 21 22 23 Dated: October 12, 2018 STATE OF NEW YORK : COUNTY OF ORANGE TOWN OF NEWBURGH ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X In the Matter of JAMES AND CAROLE LOUPE, (59-1-1) R-1 Zone 17 Sycamore Drive, Newburgh, New York - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X DATED: September 27, 2018 TIME: 7:15 p.m. PLACE: Town of Newburgh, New York 1496 Route 300 Newburgh, New York 12550 Patrick DeGiorgio, Court Reporter BOARD MEMBERS: DARRIN SCALZO, Chairman PETER OLYMPIA JOHN McKELVEY RICHARD LEVIN JOHN MASTEN ANTHONY MARINO DARRELL BELL (Not Present) ALSO PRESENT: DAVID DONOVAN, ESQ. GERALD CANFIELD SIOBHAN JABLESNIK - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - MICHELLE L. CONERO PMB #276 56 North Plank Road - Suite 1 Newburgh, New York 12550 (845) 451-4163 1 2 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Our second applicant this evening is 4 James and Carol Loupe, 17 Sycamore Drive, 5 Newburgh, (59-1-1) R-1 Zone. 6 Variance. Area variance to keep an 7 accessory building (10 feet by 10 feet) in 8 the front yard, an area variance of an 9 existing 2-story rear/side addition (24 feet 10 by 24 feet) for the minimum side yard 11 requirement of 30 feet and an area variance 12 for a prior built enclosed porch (18 feet by 13 26 feet) for the minimum 40 foot yard 14 setback. 15 The public hearing for the 16 application, as I indicated previously, has 17 been in the proper publications. The 18 applicant sent out how many mailings? 19 MS. JABLESNIK: 20 95. And nine came back. 21 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 22 Very good. It appears all the 23 mailings and publications and postings are 24 in order. If you could introduce yourself 1 3 2 please and let us know what's going on. 3 MR. MINUTA: 4 Good evening, Mr. Chairman. My name 5 is Joseph Minuta representing Minuta 6 Architecture and Mr. and Mrs. Loupe. I also 7 have her daughter and son-in-law here as 8 well this evening. 9 We are here before you tonight because 10 we are trying to sell the home. There are 11 several items that have come up during the 12 title search as we are finding in the 13 current era. And we are trying to get these 14 items closed out and sanctified to the town 15 so we can move forward in closing on them. 16 We are seeking tonight an area 17 variance to keep the accessory building 18 which is 10 by 10 in the front yard which 19 has been there for decades. It's a 20 beautiful shed and structure. It's actually 21 beautiful property. You can see from the 22 photographs you have. It's on a cul-de-sac. 23 It's been there for quite a long time. Nice 24 property, well maintained. 1 4 2 Some of the accessory aspects that we 3 have here, we have an addition off the back 4 which was part and parcel to some storage 5 garage area which was then enclosed. That's 6 actually unheated space. Then we have what 7 used to be simply an upper level deck area 8 that was then enclosed with a group of 9 window. It's a three season room. Those 10 things existed. The second story item did 11 exist with the house when it was 12 constructed. It was simply enclosed. We 13 are simply here to try to close these things 14 up. 15 Some of the background on this, the 16 reason some of these things were done, it's 17 really more of an emergency situation for 18 the owner. The owner at one point in time 19 was a veteran and unfortunately due to some 20 of his ailments had to have some amputations 21 done, and so they made accessory areas 22 accessible for him for a wheelchair to be 23 able to live in his own home. That is kind 24 of where this generated from. We are here 1 5 2 tonight asking for the variance, that it 3 happened here as well as if you take a look 4 at the lot, it's a corner lot. It's really 5 more pie shaped. It has no backyard. 6 There's really no place else on the lot to 7 do anything. Had the building actually been 8 properly located within the setback 9 requirements from the original builder, 10 these items would not be an issue. 11 Unfortunately those were the reasons what we 12 had to build on. I hope you can appreciate 13 that. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 Thank you. I would concur with your 16 assessment. The property is very neatly 17 kept. The photographs are there, but it's a 18 nice quiet neighborhood except for the 19 Thruway. I did notice that there's major 20 construction going on behind the house. 21 Really my opinion is the only adjoiner, 22 contiguous adjoiner that could be affected 23 by this would be the one if you are facing 24 the house directly to the left. Other than 1 6 2 that, to the right it's wooded and also 3 bordered by the road. Everything appears 4 very neat. I have no other comments other 5 than that. I turn to Mr. Olympia. Do you 6 have any comments? 7 MR. OLYMPIA: 8 Since the house is for sale I really 9 don't have any problem with the variance 10 that you requested for the addition in the 11 back. I would not like to see that variance 12 continue for that shed in the front yard. I 13 think that should be removed. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 Is that something the applicants would 16 consider? 17 MR. MINUTA: 18 We prefer to keep it for the simple 19 reason it's not a maintenance shed. There's 20 actually electric to it. It's a pretty 21 fortified structure. To remove all of that 22 would be quite an expense. Again, they 23 don't really have a rear yard because it's 24 pie shaped. Again, it is well landscaped. 1 7 2 There's never been any complaints against it 3 for as long as it's existed, and I think 4 it's over 20 years. 5 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 6 Sir, state your name? 7 MR. MEHRHOF: 8 Edward Mehrhof. I'm the son-in-law 9 for my mother-in-law, Carole Loupe. The 10 shed was there probably 45 years at this 11 point. It's a very well maintained shed. 12 There was just some rakes and shovels and 13 lawn equipment that my father-in-law who 14 died last year, which is what also led to 15 this situation, he just stored those items 16 in the shed. 17 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 18 That you very much. While you were 19 standing there, Mr. Minuta was pretty 20 emphatic that at this point -- I'll say it's 21 not on the table, but should the variances 22 hang on the removal of that shed, I just 23 wanted to bring -- we will have an 24 opportunity to revisit this in a little 1 8 2 while. That's one of the concerns from one 3 of the board members already is that the 4 shed not be maintained. I'll move over to 5 Mr. McKelvey. 6 MR. McKELVEY: 7 I would say the same thing. It is 8 really quite a ways from the front of the 9 house which is not allowed. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 Mr. Levin? 12 MR. LEVIN: 13 I'm voting like down the road. I 14 would vote to remove the shed also. You are 15 asking for quite a bit for the additions 16 that have been there a long time. I know 17 there's other people here that put additions 18 on their home. I did on mine. Not paying 19 the taxes for it. They weren't paying the 20 taxes all those years. Not that you go 21 back, I'm not saying that, but I don't like 22 the shed on there. 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 Mr. Masten? 1 9 2 MR. MASTEN: 3 I feel the same way. The location and 4 there's more of a -- in the back of the 5 house it's more readily used and even though 6 the shed is maintained, I still feel it 7 should be removed. 8 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 9 Mr. Marino? 10 MR. MARINO: 11 I'm in agreement with what has been 12 said so far, but it's not a live or die 13 situation. If the shed can't be removed I 14 could still support the request, but I would 15 prefer that it be removed. It's not that 16 attractive. I didn't think, but if it can't 17 be, it can't be. I can live with that. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 No questions from the board regarding 20 the other variances regarding the house and 21 the additions? 22 MR. MASTEN: 23 No. 24 MR. McKELVEY: 1 10 2 You said that the back section, the 3 upper section was there, you just closed it 4 in? 5 MR. MEHRHOF: 6 Correct. 7 MR. LEVIN: 8 How long ago was that? 9 MR. MINUTA: 10 It's in the documentation. Forgive me 11 for this. We were back -- I believe back in 12 the '80s, the enclosure for the second 13 story. 14 MR. MEHRHOF: 15 Early '70s. Early 1970's. 16 MR. MINUTA: 17 If I may just confer with my client 18 with what we just discussed? 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 Certainly. Mr. Minuta, hearing what 21 board's comments were, it appears that it 22 would be possible to relocate the shed. It 23 would appear that if the topography would 24 allow, if they would relocate the shed to 1 11 2 perhaps the highest side of the block wall 3 or behind the structure so they could still 4 maintain that storage area, it appears they 5 have the possibility to do that. 6 MR. MINUTA: 7 I appreciate that. I just did confer 8 with my client. If correcting the approvals 9 becomes contingent upon the shed, they are 10 willing to remove the shed if necessary. I 11 simply state that the shed is sort of 12 fortified in that location. It has electric 13 running to it. To remove that is quite a 14 substantial cost, but if that is what the 15 board deems necessary, my client will be 16 willing to do that if this keeps the other 17 variances hung in the balance. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 Thank you. 20 MR. MINUTA: 21 Thank you. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 I'll give the board one more 24 opportunity and then I will open it up to 1 12 2 the public. 3 MR. McKELVEY: 4 I'm fine. 5 MR. LEVIN: 6 Fine. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Anyone from the public here to speak 9 about this application? Please come forward 10 and state your name. 11 MR. LOUPE: 12 Good evening. My name is Jeffrey A. 13 Loupe. I'm here to represent my mother and 14 my father. I grew up in that house 40 15 years. My dad was a retired marine, a war 16 veteran. Always kept the property 17 immaculate, the way we were raised. The 18 reason why that room had to get done, my dad 19 had a ruptured aneurysm, lost both legs, 20 double amputee, became wheelchair bound, 21 that was the reason why we did what we had 22 to do to redo the downstairs to accommodate 23 my father who could no longer get upstairs. 24 If we have to take the shed down, I'll 1 13 2 personally take it down to get the variance 3 that we need. My mom purchased a home in 4 Florida. This house is too big for her and 5 her two little puppies. That's why we were 6 seeking to get the variance so she can move 7 on with it. Like I stated, if we have to 8 take the shed down, whatever it costs we 9 will take care of it to get it out of the 10 way to make everybody happy. We are not 11 here to upset anybody. We just want to 12 close one chapter with my father passing and 13 let my mom move on so she can get to her new 14 home and continue living her life as much as 15 she possibly can. 16 MR. McKELVEY: 17 Could you move to the shed to the 18 back? 19 MR. LOUPE: 20 I'll take the shed down. It's easier 21 to take it down and dispose of it. I have 22 heavy equipment, roll off boxes to take it 23 out, whatever has to be done to take it out, 24 I'll take it out. Thank you for your time. 1 14 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Thank you very much. 4 MR. DONOVAN: 5 Thank you. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 Anyone else here wish to speak about 8 this application? Hearing none, I'll give 9 the board one more opportunity. Mr. 10 Olympia? 11 MR. OLYMPIA: 12 I'm fine. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Mr. McKelvey? 15 MR. McKELVEY: 16 Fine. 17 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 18 Mr. Levin? 19 MR. LEVIN: 20 Fine. 21 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 22 Mr. Masten? 23 MR. MASTEN: 24 Fine. 1 15 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Mr. Marino? 4 MR. MARINO: 5 Fine. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 If I may hear a motion to close the 8 public hearing? 9 MR. McKELVEY: 10 I'll make that motion. 11 MR. MASTEN: 12 I'll second it. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 We have a motion from Mr. McKelvey and 15 a second from Mr. Masten. Roll call. Mr. 16 Levin? 17 MR. LEVIN: 18 Yes. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 Mr. Marino? 21 MR. MARINO: 22 Yes. 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 Mr. Masten? 1 16 2 MR. MASTEN: 3 Yes. 4 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 5 Mr. McKelvey? 6 MR. McKELVEY: 7 Yes. 8 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 9 Mr. Olympia? 10 MR. OLYMPIA: 11 Yes. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 And I concur as well. Public hearing 14 is closed. We will do our best to render a 15 decision this evening. 16 17 18 (Time noted 7:35 p.m.) 19 20 (Decision: Time Resumed 8:30 p.m.) 21 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Our second application this evening is 24 for Carol Loupe, 17 Sycamore Drive. 1 17 2 MR. CANFIELD: 3 The first application, the SEQRA 4 determination. 5 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 6 I mentioned they were all type 2's. 7 MR. CANFIELD: 8 Thank you. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 James and Carol Loupe, 17 Sycamore 11 Drive, Newburgh, (59-1-1) R-1 Zone. Area 12 variance to keep an accessory building (10 13 feet by 10 feet) in the front yard, an area 14 variance of an existing 2-story rear/side 15 addition (24 feet by 24 feet) for the 16 minimum side yard requirement of 30 feet and 17 an area variance for a prior built enclosed 18 porch (18 feet by 26 feet) for the minimum 19 40 foot yard side view set back. 20 We have any more board discussion on 21 this application? I will move onto the 22 criteria. The first one being whether or 23 not the benefit can be achieved by other 24 means feasible to the applicant? Well, for 1 18 2 the additions, anything connected to the 3 house it doesn't appear so. With regards to 4 the shed we have heard testimony from the 5 applicants that they are willing to remove 6 it. Second, if there's an undesirable 7 change in the neighborhood character or a 8 detriment to nearby properties. We have 9 heard no testimony from any adjoining 10 properties to state such. The third, 11 whether the request is substantial, and it 12 doesn't appear so. 13 MR. McKELVEY: 14 No. 15 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 16 Fourth, whether the request will have 17 adverse physical or environmental effects. 18 MR. McKELVEY: 19 No. 20 MR. MARINO: 21 No. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Fifth, whether the alleged difficulty 24 is self-created, relative and not 1 19 2 determinative. Yes, it's self-created, but 3 it doesn't appear to be -- it has a long 4 history behind it I suppose. That being 5 said, if I could look to the board for a 6 motion. Mr. Levin? 7 MR. LEVIN: 8 Motion to approve with the removal of 9 the shed. The gentleman agreed. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 I have a motion for approval, 12 conditioned upon removal of the shed in the 13 front yard. 14 MR. McKELVEY: 15 I'll second. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 Second from Mr. McKelvey. Roll call. 18 Mr. Levin? 19 MR. LEVIN: 20 Yes. 21 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 22 Mr. Marino? 23 MR. MARINO: 24 Yes. 1 20 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Mr. Masten? 4 MR. MASTEN: 5 Yes. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 Mr. McKelvey? 8 MR. McKELVEY: 9 Yes. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 Mr. Olympia? 12 MR. OLYMPIA: 13 Yes. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 I vote yes as well. The motion is 16 carried. Application is approved with the 17 condition that the shed is removed. 18 MR. MINUTA: 19 Do we need a permit to remove the 20 shed? 21 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 22 I'll defer that to the code 23 compliance. 24 MR. CANFIELD: 1 21 2 Is that shed on the assessor's card? 3 I believe it is. 4 MR. MINUTA: 5 I don't know. 6 MR. CANFIELD: 7 You can handle that one of two ways. 8 If you can convince the assessor's office to 9 remove the shed from the card you don't need 10 a permit. In the past some of our assessors 11 used the building permit as the only vehicle 12 for removing items from the inventory. 13 MR. MINUTA: 14 Thank you. 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 1 22 2 STATE OF NEW YORK ) 3 ) ss: 4 COUNTY OF ORANGE ) 5 6 7 I, PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO, a Shorthand 8 Reporter and Notary Public within and for 9 the State of New York, do hereby certify 10 that the foregoing is a true and accurate 11 record of the minutes having been 12 stenographically recorded by me and 13 transcribed under my supervision to the best 14 of my knowledge and belief. 15 16 17 18 19 X______________________________ 20 PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO 21 22 23 Dated: October 12, 2018 STATE OF NEW YORK : COUNTY OF ORANGE TOWN OF NEWBURGH ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X In the Matter of JOHN AND CAROL HUDELSON, (9-3-50.11) R-3 Zone 200 Oak Street, Newburgh, New York - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X DATED: September 27, 2018 TIME: 7:35 p.m. PLACE: Town of Newburgh, New York 1496 Route 300 Newburgh, New York 12550 Patrick DeGiorgio, Court Reporter BOARD MEMBERS: DARRIN SCALZO, Chairman PETER OLYMPIA JOHN McKELVEY RICHARD LEVIN JOHN MASTEN ANTHONY MARINO DARRELL BELL (Not Present) ALSO PRESENT: DAVID DONOVAN, ESQ. GERALD CANFIELD SIOBHAN JABLESNIK - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - MICHELLE L. CONERO PMB #276 56 North Plank Road - Suite 1 Newburgh, New York 12550 (845) 451-4163 1 2 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Our next application is John and Carol 4 Hudelson, 200 Oak Street, Newburgh 5 (9-3-50.11) R-3 Zone. 6 Variance. Area variance to keep an 7 accessory building (8.25 feet by 33 feet) 8 built in front yard without a permit for the 9 mounting of solar panels on the roof. 10 The applicant sent out how many 11 letters? 12 MS. JABLESNIK: 13 20. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 20. All mailings, publications, 16 postings are in order? 17 MS. JABLESNIK: 18 Yes. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 Good evening, Mrs. Hudelson. 21 MS. PAULI: 22 Good evening. My name is Carol Pauli. 23 My husband and I, John Hudelson, we own the 24 two and a half acre lot where we are 1 3 2 requesting a variance for this farm shed. I 3 do have to mention a couple of errors. One 4 says on the agenda at least, it says this is 5 a front yard. I think that's a clerical 6 error. It's not a front yard, we are in the 7 back of the property. I don't know if you 8 are seeing that. I just saw that listed on 9 the agenda and it was a request for a front 10 yard shed. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 Looking at the map, I concur. 13 MS. PAULI: 14 So let me say briefly why this is a 15 prior built building. We were newly in the 16 agricultural district when we began to work 17 on putting up an agricultural shed. I 18 called the town in the spring of last year 19 to say we are in the ag district, what do I 20 need to build a shed? I thought we would be 21 exempt. We are exempt in some ways, not 22 exempt in others. The response I got was, 23 well, talk to the state. I called the state 24 and they said you don't need anything from 1 4 2 us. Rather than argue with the town and say 3 I really do need a building permit from you, 4 I just thought -- I think we are okay and so 5 we built and then that's why we are as a 6 prior built structure. 7 There are two reasons that we request 8 this variance and we think it's something 9 that you should do. One is, it's a very 10 small variance, it's probably 330 feet at 11 the outside if I measure a full, you know, 12 to kind of stretch the dimension. In R-3 13 Zoning a lot can be as small as a third of 14 an acre. We have two and a half acres. If 15 we look at the lot, the footprint of our 16 house plus the accessory building that you 17 approved two years ago amounts to about 3 18 percent of the lot area, the two and a half 19 acres that we are on. Add the shed, you are 20 still under 3 percent. It's not a big 21 variance with respect to the land that we 22 are on. It's not going to crowd the 23 property. It's not going to hurt the 24 character of the neighborhood. 1 5 2 The second reason, this is an 3 agricultural building and we are in the New 4 York Agricultural District. So this is an 5 agricultural use. When you went there and 6 if you looked at the pictures, what you see 7 inside are logs from clearing some vineyard 8 land as we expanded. Some wood, metal 9 stakes, wires for trellises, rigid plastic 10 sleeves that we put around the base of newly 11 planted vines to protect them, mulch, straw, 12 peat moss, fertilizer, shovels and tools. 13 It's an agricultural use. There's also more 14 to go in there once we enclose the sides. 15 The pruning tools we use once we enclose the 16 vineyard are currently in my kitchen 17 cabinets. The bird caller boxes, these are 18 recordings of predatory birds put up in the 19 vineyard in the fall so when the grapes are 20 ripe, the neighboring birds hear these bird 21 calls and stay away. Those right now are in 22 my husband's workshop. Other scare kinds of 23 devices to keep birds away have been kept in 24 our house. Spraying equipment is in our 1 6 2 house so when workers come to work on the 3 vineyard they have to come in the house to 4 get spraying equipment. That goes into the 5 shed. Bee keeping materials and boxes and 6 supers, we did have bees. We want to have 7 them again. Right now we have a friend who 8 is storing those things for us. Those were 9 in my laundry room. We are very keen to 10 have this shed to house that kind of thing 11 on a dirt ground with big bays that we can 12 get in and out of. 13 Looking at that building of course you 14 will see that it is very well sited for 15 solar panel. That was no accident. That 16 was our decision that when we were building 17 a shed we would also use it to install solar 18 panel. This is when it came to the town's 19 attention when the solar company came to 20 install the panels and then the town said 21 wait a minute, what shed? We don't see a 22 permit for one. That's why it gets called a 23 solar shed. It was not a solar shed in our 24 thinking. It's a farm shed upon which we 1 7 2 are putting solar panels. 3 The shed faces south. The roof is not 4 perfect, but it's good for solar panels. 5 And the idea is this is just an efficient 6 use of our land and sunshine. This is our 7 intention to have the panels there as well. 8 If you look in the plans I guess you 9 can see to the south the open land and 10 vegetable garden that are there, this gives 11 good access for the sun without having to be 12 concerned with the trees that we want to 13 keep on the south end of the property for 14 buffering from the neighbors and for 15 aesthetic reasons and all of that. 16 It's already solar ready this barn, 17 and once more designing a building with 18 solar power in mind is consistent with town 19 code 185-86. New structures will be sited 20 to take advantage of solar access insofar as 21 practical including the orientation of 22 proposed buildings with respect to sun 23 angles. We are doing it. 24 Also, I should note that I was 1 8 2 concerned and checked, installing solar 3 panels will not change the building's status 4 as an agricultural building. To check that, 5 I wanted to be sure, I got in touch with 6 Robert Summers of the Department of 7 Agricultural and Markets. He got in touch 8 with the Department of State's codes 9 division. I'll just read from his e-mail to 10 me. An e-mail from DOS codes division 11 states that they examined your drawing and 12 intended uses for the building. It was 13 their opinion that the building used for 14 agricultural purposes is an agricultural 15 building as defined within the state 16 building code. They further stated that 17 such a building can be used to support solar 18 cells without changing the buildings status 19 as an agricultural building. 20 So it's a small variance. The shed is 21 an agricultural building in the state 22 agricultural district and approving this 23 variance satisfies two New York State goals, 24 protecting farmland and promoting solar 1 9 2 energy, so please approve the variance. 3 MR. McKELVEY: 4 Just because you are in the ag 5 district doesn't make you a farm. Doesn't 6 make it farmland. 7 MS. PAULI: 8 We do have a farm operation there. 9 MR. McKELVEY: 10 Am I right? 11 MR. DONOVAN: 12 If I may, Mr. Chairman, relative to 13 that issue, agricultural uses do have to 14 comply with local zoning. 15 MS. PAULI: 16 Yes, and that's why we are here asking 17 for a variance. 18 MR. DONOVAN: 19 And if I could ask code compliance, 20 was it your determination that the shed was 21 in the front yard or not was it not your 22 determination, if you recall? 23 MR. CANFIELD: 24 It is not. 1 10 2 MR. DONOVAN: 3 I didn't see it in the packet, but I 4 did see it on the agenda. 5 MR. CANFIELD: 6 Oak Street makes a turn, but there's 7 an adjoining parcel. Therefore that shed is 8 not in the front yard. 9 MR. DONOVAN: 10 Just for clarification, because it's 11 an appeal for your determination whether 12 code compliance that made the determination 13 to clarify that they had to so the appeal 14 was just the square footage. 15 MR. CANFIELD: 16 Yes, that's correct. 17 MS. PAULI: 18 I think it might have been a clerical 19 error. Another one neighboring us on the 20 agenda had said front yard. It's just a 21 guess. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 The longer I live in the house I live 24 in, the more space I need for stuff. We all 1 11 2 know that. I appreciate all of the items 3 that you went through that will be stored in 4 the shed. We have the luxury of having 5 meeting minutes from I don't know how many 6 times you were here, Mrs. Hudelson, five or 7 six times. 8 MS. PAULI: 9 Seemed like a million. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 If anyone should be aware of the code 12 and requirements, you would have been a 13 great candidate for that. The things you 14 had mentioned there are mentioned in your 15 testimony from four years ago, three, four 16 years ago, so these items that you want to 17 store there, why aren't they in the shed 18 that you already put up? 19 MS. PAULI: 20 What we now call the barn. We had to 21 call it an accessory building then. We are 22 now in the ag district, we call it a barn. 23 That has power tools, mowers, it has any 24 number of other things. I have a son who 1 12 2 has welding equipment. We have a loom and a 3 potters wheel. We have plenty of uses for 4 that building. Also please note that is not 5 required to be an agricultural use, that was 6 granted a variance. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Absolutely. 9 MS. PAULI: 10 So the agricultural things can now go 11 into the shed and we have space then for 12 other things to store. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Your testimony also from a few years 15 back, you were -- I saw it, it is beautiful. 16 What you did with that accessory building is 17 beautiful. 18 MS. PAULI: 19 Thank you. Thank you very much for 20 your part in doing that. We are very happy 21 with it. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 The testimony that you had given years 24 back was you were very interested in 1 13 2 maintaining the character of the 3 neighborhood and you wanted it to blend in 4 and have this roof dominant shed. It just 5 appears very out of character to me. You 6 walk up on it and it's just a big canvas in 7 front of you and not the kind -- not what I 8 would have expected after the concerns that 9 you had had three years ago. I was kind of 10 surprised by that from what we had been 11 discussing. I have other things that I was 12 formulating, but I want to turn it over to 13 the other board members and then we will 14 come back. Mr. Olympia, do you have 15 anything? 16 MR. OLYMPIA: 17 I do. Would you describe your 18 operation as a commercial agricultural 19 operation? 20 MS. PAULI: 21 Commercial? 22 MR. OLYMPIA: 23 Do you sell product out of there? 24 MS. PAULI: 1 14 2 No. 3 MR. OLYMPIA: 4 For your own consumption? 5 MS. PAULI: 6 It's a farm operation. To be growing 7 grapes is an agricultural farm operation. 8 So is processing them. Part of that 9 structure also will be used for that 10 processing so that is part of what will also 11 happen. 12 MR. OLYMPIA: 13 I understand. Who is the end user? 14 MS. PAULI: 15 We are working with a commercial 16 winery, Whitecliff Winery in Gardiner. We 17 are working with them and producing wine, 18 but they do the production there. 19 MR. OLYMPIA: 20 Did you have a crop this year? 21 MS. PAULI: 22 Yes. I wasn't around for the harvest. 23 I don't know how much it was, but yes, we 24 did harvest. 1 15 2 MR. OLYMPIA: 3 I looked at the vines and stuff, they 4 looked like they were abandoned. 5 MS. PAULI: 6 No, they were not. 7 MR. OLYMPIA: 8 That's why I asked the question. 9 MS. PAULI: 10 No, no. I think it's just that the 11 harvest is over at this point so they will 12 be -- the leaves will be turning and what 13 grapes are hanging there be will be dried 14 out and the others were cut down and 15 harvested. I can find out when the harvest 16 was if you'd like. 17 MR. OLYMPIA: 18 Thank you. 19 MS. PAULI: 20 My husband did that. I teach out of 21 state so I have to be gone during the 22 harvest. 23 MR. OLYMPIA: 24 Thank you. 1 16 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Mr. Levin, anything? 4 MR. LEVIN: 5 You said you came to the Town of 6 Newburgh and you asked for permission. 7 MS. PAULI: 8 I called them on the phone. 9 MR. LEVIN: 10 Who did you speak to? 11 MS. PAULI: 12 Someone at the front desk. I don't 13 know. They went back and gave them the 14 message and came back and said talk to the 15 state. That's all I did. 16 MR. LEVIN: 17 I would think that you going back 18 three years ago would know and should get 19 permission before you start something. Of 20 anybody you should know. That's all. 21 MS. PAULI: 22 I knew that eventually if I needed 23 permission I would be paying a fine for 24 having a prior built structure and I thought 1 17 2 all right, that's what I'll have to do. 3 MR. LEVIN: 4 Well, it could be more drastic than 5 that. They could say please take it down. 6 I'm not saying that. 7 MS. PAULI: 8 Thank you. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 Mr. Masten, anything? 11 MR. MASTEN: 12 I have nothing. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Mr. Marino? 15 16 MR. MARINO: 17 I have nothing. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 It came back to me, the other question 20 I was going to ask. You provided sketches 21 which have architectural stamps on them. 22 They say drawn by, you know, in the small 23 title above your handwriting, Wholesome 24 Pauli Chicken Coop. That appears on this. 1 18 2 Are we talking about a chicken coop, are we 3 talking about a shed? 4 MS. PAULI: 5 Not at this point. At some point in 6 the future I could imagine putting chickens 7 in there. I've had chickens in the backyard 8 before and they died because of predators, 9 but I'm not at this point able to do that 10 because I don't -- as I said I teach out of 11 state. That is not a use I would do 12 immediately. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Give me one moment. Gerry, I don't 15 mean to put you on the spot. Our solar code 16 in R-3, does that allow solar panels on 17 stand alone structures, ground mounted 18 structures? 19 MR. CANFIELD: 20 I wouldn't deem this as ground mounted 21 solar panels. These solar panels, if they 22 are installed, will be on the roof of a 23 structure which is permitted. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 19 2 Okay. 3 MR. DONOVAN: 4 Subject of course to whatever code 5 requirements there are relative to 6 construction of the accessory building, I 7 would assume, meaning that it has to be able 8 to support the installation of the solar 9 panels? 10 MR. CANFIELD: 11 That's correct. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 It's a substantial structure. Gerry, 14 if they had not called this a shed -- well, 15 we don't allow ground mounted solar in R-3; 16 correct? 17 MR. CANFIELD: 18 That's correct. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 Okay. 21 MS. PAULI: 22 I would like to say one other thing 23 about the aesthetics. I'm not crazy about 24 solar panels. That's one reason it's facing 1 20 2 the southern part of the yard. I think it 3 has the least impact there and the sides of 4 it will match the house and the barn. It 5 will be the same channel rustic cedar. To 6 the extent that we can make it attractive, 7 we will, but there's not much more I can do 8 about that and still have an appropriate 9 angle. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 I'm going to make an assumption that 12 with the steel roof on your dwelling as well 13 as the accessory permit we gave you a few 14 years back, attachment of solar panels to 15 that is difficult. 16 MS. PAULI: 17 This is true and they are also angled 18 the wrong way. Everything that we have up 19 there now has trees on the south end of it 20 so that wouldn't work. So when we decided 21 to do the shed we thought this was the place 22 that we actually have some control of the 23 site. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 21 2 Okay. I'm going to give the board one 3 last opportunity. Any questions? 4 MR. MARINO: 5 No. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 Would you prefer Pauli or Hudelson? 8 MS. PAULI: 9 Either is fine. Hudelson is my title. 10 Mrs. Hudelson is fine and may be easier for 11 your records. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 Very good. Hearing nothing from the 14 board at this point, I would like to give 15 the opportunity to the members of the public 16 who may want to speak about this applicant. 17 Anyone have anything? Please come forward. 18 MS. REED: 19 My name is Claire Reed. I'm the next 20 door neighbor of the Hudelsons. I've been 21 here before too. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Probably six time just as Mrs. 24 Hudelson. 1 22 2 MS. REED: 3 Probably right. At any rate, some of 4 the things that I'm going to mention, I'm 5 going to read this because I get nervous 6 having been here and it's already been 7 touched on. Just bear with me. I was 8 confused when I saw this application because 9 the Notice of Hearing I received in the mail 10 stated that this was an application to keep 11 an unpermitted accessory building for the 12 mounting of solar panels. The Hudelson's 13 application to your board which is part of 14 their documentation made no mention of solar 15 panels. Rather stated that this structure 16 is a storage shed needed to store mulch, 17 peat moss, stakes, and other supplies and 18 materials. The case being made for an area 19 variance on the basis of a need for storage. 20 As this board is aware and as you mentioned, 21 in July of 2015 the Hudelsons were granted 22 an area variance of 200 square feet for what 23 at the time they called the shed which is 24 now referred to as the barn. At that time 1 23 2 they stated the space was needed for, as you 3 mentioned, the same supplies we see in this 4 application. So less than three years after 5 the completion of a 1,200 square foot barn 6 at ground level, they are asking for more 7 storage space. Given that the Hudelsons 8 have had a small vineyard for all of the 22 9 years that we have been neighbors, over 19 10 of which they had no accessory buildings, 11 it's hard to believe they have a need for 12 additional storage beyond this large barn in 13 such a short time. It's kind of incredible 14 to hear how much stuff is stored off site 15 and in their house when they have this 16 massive barn. It's my understanding that 17 ground mounted solar panels, and to me these 18 look very much like ground mounded solar 19 panels, and I guess if you call it a shed, a 20 roof, has half a roof right now and maybe 21 they're going to close it in, but right now 22 that is exactly what you build if you just 23 wanted to mount ground solar panels is not 24 permitted in R-3 Zoning. Is it possible 1 24 2 that additional storage is not actually 3 necessary, but by calling this structure a 4 shed the Hudelsons can mount solar panels on 5 the roof? I think the board has to consider 6 the possibility that the shed is really 7 nothing more than a structure for ground 8 mounted solar panels. The Hudelsons request 9 for an additional 273 square feet would 10 place them over 47 percent above the 1,000 11 square feet allowance. Clearly solar panels 12 is a great goal, but the Hudelsons have two 13 large structures on which roof mounted 14 panels are an option. From what I read, 15 there are laminates that you can just put 16 on. You don't even have to mount panels 17 which can be mounted with brackets. One 18 thing I read, it's actually even easier and 19 better to put them on metal roofs than on 20 asphalt roofs. At any rate, the hardship in 21 this case is clearly self-created. 22 Finally, if you do allow this storage 23 shed and knowing that it's intended to 24 support solar panels, my question is what 1 25 2 setbacks will you require? If it's not the 3 front yard, the setbacks for solar panels 4 from what I read on the town's site is that 5 they are greater than setbacks for sheds and 6 accessory buildings. So I kind of get the 7 impression that by calling this a shed we 8 cannot only bypass zoning regarding mounted 9 solar collectors, ground mounted solar 10 collectors, but we can also bypass the 11 setbacks required. 12 I guess I'm a little concerned because 13 somebody on the board who may or may not be 14 here now, I didn't take the time to read the 15 minutes, commented you know what happens, we 16 are going to be back here in three years. 17 We are not here exactly for the same reason 18 he stated we might be back here, but we are 19 back here. Now maybe in the future checking 20 on this. 21 I just feel like I have nothing 22 against solar panels. They are not that 23 visible, especially with the trees up from 24 my property. When the trees are down, who 1 26 2 knows? At any rate, I'm not against them. 3 What I am against is circumventing the 4 intent of the zoning rules and maybe, okay, 5 we will get this, then we will ask for that, 6 and then we will go here and then close it 7 in, then we'll have chickens. How many 8 buildings? How much space? If they run out 9 of space, 1,200 square feet in three years, 10 now there's another building, and yes, I 11 went to meetings where they applied for the 12 final -- whatever the designation is, the 13 farming designation, and that was one of my 14 concerns. That opens a wider gate for them 15 to do other things. I'm just concerned with 16 where this will end, if it will end. Thank 17 you very much for your time. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 Thank you. Mr. Hughes in the back, 20 please come to the front. 21 MR. HUGHES: 22 I'd first like to do a little bit of 23 housekeeping on what goes on in a proceeding 24 and I think your counsel will concur. The 1 27 2 Paulis and Hudelsons are attorneys by 3 trades. They know what to do and what not 4 to do. In a court as this is considered, no 5 one really needs to be sworn in. We are all 6 under oath here giving testimony, even the 7 people in the audience that don't have a 8 license or anything else. I have to say I 9 grew a full beard going to all the meetings 10 pertinent to this property on the project 11 and as it creeped along and got bigger and 12 bigger and bigger. I even attended one 13 meeting with the ag board in the county 14 which I helped revise and rewrite the laws 15 over the last 10 years, being the president 16 of the Planning Federation for the county 17 and being a board member there for over 12 18 years and being a board member here for 12 19 years as well, I heard every excuse except 20 being kidnapped by gypsies. 21 Now, there's a the lot of stuff 22 floating and flying here that wasn't put on 23 the written record, but I'd like to sum it 24 briefly without writing a book that I 1 28 2 attended one meeting where the quote was we 3 are going to do whatever we have to do to 4 avoid the Zoning Board of Appeals in the 5 Town of Newburgh. We've got a very slippery 6 slope we are sliding on here and the truth, 7 the whole truth and nothing but the truth is 8 not so frequently spoken. Be careful. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 Any other members of the public here 11 to speak about this applicant? Feel free to 12 speak. 13 MS. PAULI: 14 I did not want to have to come back 15 before the Zoning Board of Appeals. I did 16 not want to have to go here again because as 17 you may remember, having built that barn 18 took three, four, 16, however many sessions, 19 it was grueling, it was not a happy 20 situation. It didn't do good things for my 21 relationships with my neighbors. It just 22 seemed like a struggle to build something 23 that was very nice on our yard within our 24 yard and our land. So I had hoped that I 1 29 2 would not have to do this and would not -- 3 that our agricultural designation and our 4 having the land for ag use would simply be 5 an easier thing and we would get our permit 6 and we would proceed. So it's true. I 7 don't know that anybody welcomes coming to 8 the board and testify. You are nice and I 9 appreciate the work that you have done, but 10 this has been a difficult thing. It was 11 difficult the last time. I'm trying to 12 think if there was something else. We do 13 have more uses for that barn that was 14 already there. We want to use it in the 15 process of wine that comes from the grapes, 16 that is also a farm use and a farm operation 17 which is permitted in an ag district, so 18 that will use up some of that space at 19 least. The shed is for the kinds of things 20 that it has in it now. You probably saw 21 them out in the yard, you saw more things 22 that ought to be in the shed and picked up 23 out of the weeds. It is true we ran a 24 vineyard for 22 years, they were there even 1 30 2 longer, probably 30 without an accessory 3 building there. We had a yard full of tarps 4 and tarps and piles of tarps over things. 5 It was quite an eye sore. It's very nice 6 now to be a able to put things away. This 7 shed is the last structure that we plan to 8 put there, but in building it we want to be 9 sure we make good efficient use of the land 10 and so that's why we have angled it the way 11 we have. As my neighbor says, it is not a 12 problem for her on her property. Certainly 13 not for us. I don't think it does anything 14 bad to the neighborhood in terms of the 15 character of the neighborhood. We are the 16 ones that look at it and it's a distance 17 from the house. It's still a pleasant place 18 to be. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 Thank you. I'm going to go back three 21 years. My memory is not that great. I have 22 meeting minutes I can read. At the time one 23 of our zoning board members, Mr. Manley, had 24 brought up the reason that we had asked you 1 31 2 to reduce the structure of your height at 3 the time was because of the things evolved. 4 We were concerned that your accessory 5 structure could turn into an accessory 6 apartment some day. We try to send the 7 right message when we vote as we do. Mrs. 8 Reed had just said, these are her words, not 9 mine, the appearance of circumventing the 10 process here. As we stand here any 11 applicant that's reading these meetings 12 minutes now if we were to grant you a 13 variance to build a shed that is not in 14 compliance or follow code for what solar 15 installations would be in an R-3 district 16 come to us and ask us for forgiveness rather 17 than permission and perhaps get what they 18 wanted right from the start. That's my 19 biggest concern. 20 MS. PAULI: 21 I'm not sure if there's anything I can 22 say. 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 I'm not sure. 1 32 2 MS. PAULI: 3 We built on the understanding that we 4 would be exempt and, in fact, there were 5 conversations that I later had with the town 6 about whether we would be exempt. I know 7 Mr. Canfield said if you have the ag 8 exemption then you don't need anything from 9 us. I got in touch with the state again and 10 we had a series of e-mails and this one I 11 read to you was part of that, saying what 12 kind of exemption then. We are exempt from 13 the building code for a shed, but not tax 14 exempt. So there was some confusion there. 15 I went through a number of steps trying to 16 iron that out to understand where we stood. 17 So the shed is compliant in terms of 18 setbacks. It's more than 20 feet from one 19 corner and about 40 from another. It is 20 only 10 and a half feet tall. We were 21 careful not to make it a huge structure. We 22 want to be respectful of neighbors and what 23 they see. The only variance that it needs 24 is area. 1 33 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 For 273 square feet. 4 MS. PAULI: 5 Right. And that's all that it needs 6 to be compliant and we would like to bring 7 it into compliance. 8 MR. DONOVAN: 9 If I could just clarify. Actually the 10 allowed square footage is a thousand. This 11 has already received a variance. The 12 calculation you have for code compliance is 13 the variation on top of the variation. 14 MS. PAULI: 15 Right. 16 MR. DONOVAN: 17 So the total variance is actually 18 larger. Gerry, I'll put you on the spot for 19 a calculation. You originally or this 20 application previously received a variance 21 for an extra 200 square feet, so the total 22 variance relative to the code requirement is 23 473 square feet, not 273 square feet. 24 MS. PAULI: 1 34 2 Right. This is an additional 3 variance. 4 MR. CANFIELD: 5 The calculation before you is for this 6 building, or the structure, excuse me, that 7 is proposed and if I could just go back to 8 this nomenclature or what you want to call 9 it. I hear the word shed. We are viewing 10 this as a structure. It meets the 11 definition of a structure as it is in its 12 state right now. So relative to the solar 13 panels, if at some point in time in the 14 future when they came they are permitted to 15 be mounted to this structure. That's one 16 issue. The answer to Dave's question, the 17 variances that are stated and calculated by 18 Mr. Martinez is based on this structure. 19 MR. DONOVAN: 20 Understood. I'm saying for the 21 benefit of the board that the magnitude of 22 the variance is 47 percent. That's the 23 overall variance relevance to the maximum 24 allowable of a thousand since we are going 1 35 2 to 1473. I'm just saying the magnitude of 3 the total variance is greater than what is 4 reflected here. What is reflected, and when 5 I say here, what is reflected on the sheet 6 that we receive from code compliance is the 7 variation in addition to the existing 8 variances, if I made that clear. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 I'm clear. 11 MR. CANFIELD: 12 Cumulative. 13 MR. DONOVAN: 14 If solar panels were to be mounted, 15 because right now this is just here or 16 square footage, if solar panels were to be 17 mounted are there other requirements that 18 come into play relative to the location of 19 this shed? 20 MR. CANFIELD: 21 That I'm not aware of. I can look at 22 it. I'm not prepared to answer that 23 correctly right now. 24 MR. DONOVAN: 1 36 2 The only other comment that I would 3 make for the benefit of the board is the 4 easiest way not to come in front of the 5 board is to comply with the code. If you 6 comply with the code you don't come here. 7 MS. PAULI: 8 Understood. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 Thank you. One last opportunity. 11 MS. PAULI: 12 Since we are hearing percentages, I 13 just want to remind the board that we are 14 talking about a 3 percent land coverage by 15 these total of all the buildings that are 16 there, the house, the barn, the shed, still 17 under 3 percent of the land would be 18 covered. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 That is net including the easement 21 that runs across your property? 22 MS. PAULI: 23 I'm talking about buildings. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 37 2 3 percent relative to lot area 3 coverage. 4 MR. McKELVEY: 5 That's something different. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 Sorry. 8 MS. PAULI: 9 Lot area coverage because this is 10 zoned from a smaller piece of property than 11 we have. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 Correct. Thank you. Mr. Hughes in 14 the back, if you could come up front. 15 MR. HUGHES: 16 For the benefit of the audience and 17 the board members that may not be aware of 18 the word exempt that's being thrown around 19 here, on two and a half acres which was put 20 into the ag district as a title of the ag 21 district only, they are not an operating 22 farm, they are not a start up farm nor could 23 they ever meet the requirements. If you are 24 going to be exempt for the tax purposes, 1 38 2 unless there's seven acres, you have to 3 produce $50,000 worth of receipts. She 4 stated on the written record this evening 5 that there's no sales, there's no retail, 6 that they work with someone else and 7 whatever goes on is off site so that's a 8 moot point. However, it sounds good when 9 you throw that exempt word out there for 10 taxes, for what your use is, for what your 11 buildings are and for whatever else you 12 might want to do. The state law states 13 quite simply if the building is for 14 agricultural purposes only, and we have a 15 hybrid cap here. We have a hybrid story and 16 we have stuff being thrown around that is 17 not so necessarily true. I've watched the 18 dance go on here. I was at every meeting 19 that went on in this building and I was at 20 every meeting that went on elsewhere at the 21 ag board, the ag districts and I also read 22 all of the excerpts that went back and forth 23 between Mr. Summers who I know and I worked 24 with for a long time in the State of New 1 39 2 York and another letter by a Mr. Ball. It's 3 all that leading edge to try to convince the 4 board that we are getting it together, we 5 are finally now down to where it should be, 6 but it's never going to happen. The law 7 says you are supposed to have seven acres or 8 more. They slid in under the radar somehow 9 and got put in the district with only two 10 and a half acres. Draw your own conclusion 11 with what is really going on here. 12 MS. PAULI: 13 One of the more painful things about 14 going to these hearings is certainly not the 15 conduct of the board, but the accusations 16 and the suspicions and the worries about 17 what the Hudelsons may really be up to and 18 what do they need that space for. We did 19 not slide under any radar. We know we are 20 not tax exempt. We know we don't qualify 21 for the tax action exemption, but we are 22 certainly qualified to be in and we are in 23 the ag district and we have gone through the 24 entire process properly. If you need more 1 40 2 documentation I can gladly provide it. 3 People came to our land, they investigated 4 what we were doing, they saw the vineyard 5 which was not abandoned but functioning, it 6 was springtime and they were quite impressed 7 with the pruning job. We have a working 8 vineyard. We are pleased with it and proud 9 of what we do. There are just no deviations 10 from the rules regarding our membership in 11 the ag district. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 I've heard Mr. Hughes talk about 14 letters, I've heard you talk about letters 15 or documentation. I don't know how that 16 applies to what we are here for tonight, but 17 it was not included in any application that 18 we have. 19 MR. DONOVAN: 20 I think the narrow issue before the 21 board is the variance that's at issue 22 because of the overage in the accessory 23 structure square footage. But the law is 24 quite clear. I've been down this road 1 41 2 before in different municipalities that I've 3 represented. Ag buildings need to comply 4 with zoning. For example, distances from 5 side yards. For example, locations of front 6 yard, rural square footage, they need to 7 comply. The only consideration would be if 8 that compliance places some sort of burden 9 on the operation of the farm. Absent that 10 consideration however, they must comply with 11 zoning. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 Thank you. One last opportunity for 14 any members of the public? I'll turn to the 15 board. Mr. Olympia? 16 MR. OLYMPIA: 17 Nothing. 18 MR. McKELVEY: 19 Nothing. The only thing that upsets 20 me is you didn't get the permit in the 21 beginning. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Mr. Levin? 24 MR. LEVIN: 1 42 2 Nothing. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 Mr. Masten? 5 MR. MASTEN: 6 No. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Mr. Marino? 9 MR. MARINO: 10 No. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 That being said, I will look to the 13 board. If they are satisfied with all the 14 information that they have we can close 15 public hearing I will need a motion. 16 MR. MASTEN: 17 I make a motion. 18 MR. DONOVAN: 19 To close the public hearing? 20 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 21 Yes. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Hearing no second, do I have a motion 24 to leave the public hearing open? 1 43 2 MR. MARINO: 3 Have Mr. Donovan explain to us what 4 that means. 5 MR. DONOVAN: 6 What means? 7 MR. MARINO: 8 If we believe it open, what happens? 9 Where do we go from here? 10 MR. DONOVAN: 11 Generally speaking the purpose of the 12 public hearing is for the board to gather 13 enough information for them to reasonably 14 make a decision. On occasion this board has 15 continued public hearings. You are not 16 allowed to leave them open from now until 17 the Mets win the World Series. So when this 18 board has done that in the past, you can 19 continue the public hearing to a certain 20 date and typically tell the applicant, you 21 know, we need in certain cases we asked for 22 a certified survey. Instances where we have 23 had hand drawn notations on a map that 24 appear to not accurately represent what is 1 44 2 before us. In another instance we ask for 3 engineered stamped plans because you want to 4 make sure what you are evaluating was 5 accurately depicted. 6 MR. MARINO: 7 Are we asking them for more 8 information? 9 MR. DONOVAN: 10 I don't know. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 I haven't heard that any of our 13 questions have not been answered. 14 MR. MARINO: 15 Why would we keep it open? 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 I did not get a second to close it. 18 MR. MARINO: 19 In that case I'll give you a second. 20 MR. DONOVAN: 21 That would have been a lot faster, 22 Tony. 23 MS. PAULI: 24 May I say that as soon as I realized 1 45 2 we didn't need a building permit for sure we 3 did file for one and I have been back and 4 forth to the town a number of times trying 5 to provide all the information that they 6 need. Whether it's stamped plans by the 7 architect or another drawing or more 8 dimensions, I've been trying very hard to 9 comply with the requirements. 10 MR. McKELVEY: 11 When was the shed built? When did you 12 build the shed? 13 MS. PAULI: 14 I'm trying to remember if it was last 15 summer. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 The plans are stamped January 5th, 18 2017. 18, 19 months ago. 19 MS. PAULI: 20 When was the first application, do you 21 have that? I thought I filed that. 22 MR. CANFIELD: 23 I'll have to check the file. 24 MS. PAULI: 1 46 2 I've been trying. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 So we have a motion to close the 5 public hearing from Mr. Masten. Do we have 6 a second from Mr. Marino? 7 MR. MARINO: 8 Well, that's if -- we have no 9 additional information required, why prolong 10 it? Unless there is specific questions or 11 more information we want, it makes no sense. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 I understand. Please be advised, 14 board members, we have 62 days to act upon 15 this. 16 MR. LEVIN: 17 Yes. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 So should we not be able to come to a 20 conclusion this evening we have up to 62 21 days. I believe the applicant also has the 22 right to ask us to not render a decision 23 this evening; correct? 24 MR. DONOVAN: 1 47 2 They have the right to consent to a 3 request. 4 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 5 Okay. Mr. Canfield? 6 MR. CANFIELD: 7 The building permit was received 8 December 29th, 2017. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 Thank you. The only other benefit to 11 leaving the public hearing open, we are 12 missing one member. However, we have a 13 quorum here so that shouldn't make a 14 difference; correct? 15 MR. DONOVAN: 16 Correct. 17 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 18 So I have a motion and a second. Roll 19 call. Mr. Levin? 20 MR. LEVIN: 21 Yes. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Mr. Marino? 24 MR. MARINO: 1 48 2 Yes. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 Mr. Masten? 5 MR. MASTEN: 6 Yes. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Mr. McKelvey? 9 MR. McKELVEY: 10 Yes. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 Mr. Olympia? 13 MR. OLYMPIA: 14 Yes. 15 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 16 And I vote yes as well. The public 17 clearing is closed. We will try our best to 18 render a decision this evening. 19 20 (Time noted 8:10 p.m.) 21 22 (Decision: Time Resumed 8:35 p.m.) 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 The third application this evening, 1 49 2 John and Carol Hudelson, 200 Oak Street, 3 Newburgh (9-3-50.11) R-3 Zone. Area 4 variance to keep an accessory building (8.25 5 feet by 33 feet) built in front yard without 6 a permit for the mounting of solar panels on 7 the roof. 8 You would like to say a few words. 9 MS. PAULI: 10 Very few words. I just wanted to 11 point out when we found out that we did need 12 a building permit we stopped. We didn't 13 enclose the shed and we haven't worked 14 further on it. 15 MR. CANFIELD: 16 Also in aiding the determination of 17 whether the ag exemption was not exempt to 18 local zoning, there was a meeting held from 19 Mr. John McClarin from the county and also 20 David Church, and that was part of the 21 process in making this determination that a 22 permit is needed. 23 MS. PAULI: 24 In short, it was confusing. At least 1 50 2 to me. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 At that time had the structure already 5 been constructed? 6 MR. CANFIELD: 7 Yes. Because they were in the ag 8 district they were exempt from the building 9 process. And as the applicant has 10 testified, Mr. Bob Summers had provided her 11 with documentation that there's a section of 12 the building code that does exempt 13 agricultural structures from building code 14 requirements. However, the only vehicle to 15 get this application to the zoning board was 16 a building permit. I hope that helps 17 clarify that process how it got here. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 This is certainly an interesting and 20 difficult application. Any discussion from 21 the board? Hearing none, let's move through 22 the criteria. First one, whether or not the 23 benefit can be achieved by other means 24 feasible to the applicant? 1 51 2 MR. LEVIN: 3 I feel it can. 4 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 5 Mr. Levin, if you could expand on 6 that, how? If the benefit can be achieved 7 in another way, I did hear testimony from 8 one of the audience members this evening 9 about alternative solar applications, but is 10 that where you were headed? 11 MR. LEVIN: 12 I'm not aware of that. Let me skip 13 that. I'm sorry. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 Okay. Mr. Olympia, any comment? 16 MR. OLYMPIA: 17 No 18 MR. McKELVEY: 19 No. 20 MR. MASTEN: 21 No. 22 MR. MARINO: 23 No. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 52 2 The second, if there's an undesirable 3 change in the neighborhood character or a 4 detriment to nearby properties? Well, it is 5 on over two acres. It is screened. 6 However, as I mentioned from my visit to the 7 site, you walk up that driveway and it's 8 looking like a billboard on the Thruway. 9 It's quite a big structure. Roof dominant, 10 that's for sure. I don't know if that's a 11 detriment to nearby properties. I don't 12 recall if Mrs. Reed categorized it as a 13 detriment. 14 MS. PAULI: 15 If I may she said it was not. She 16 said she didn't really see it. 17 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 18 Miss Hudelson, at this point it's 19 board deliberations only. The third, 20 whether request is substantial? As a stand 21 alone structure, you may not consider it to 22 be substantial. However, when coupled with 23 the other variance that was granted three 24 years ago, the total percentage does -- we 1 53 2 are looking at that point, help me Dave, 3 you're an attorney. 4 MR. DONOVAN: 5 The maximum allowed square footage 6 accessory structures is a thousand feet. 7 This board previously granted a variance of 8 1,200 square feet, so that would be an extra 9 200 square feet, so what is proposed is 10 1,473, or an additional 273 square feet or 11 473 square feet over the maximum allowable 12 of 1,000. So that would be 47. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 That would be 47. We are looking at, 15 I believe, because the previous variance, 16 consideration for that initial variance is 17 also included in the way we evaluate this. 18 MR. DONOVAN: 19 If the board wants to evaluate the 20 overall impact or effect of the variance you 21 can do it on a cumulative basis. You are 22 looking at what would the total would be 23 relative to the maximum allowable. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 54 2 That being said, Mr. Olympia? 3 MR. OLYMPIA: 4 Nothing. 5 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 6 Mr. Levin? 7 MR. LEVIN: 8 Nothing. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 Mr. McKelvey? 11 MR. McKELVEY: 12 No. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Mr. Marino? 15 MR. MASTEN: 16 No. 17 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 18 The fourth, whether the request will 19 have adverse physical or environmental 20 effects. 21 MR. MARINO: 22 I don't see it. 23 MR. McKELVEY: 24 No. 1 55 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Fifth, whether the alleged difficulty 4 is self-created. And from the testimony 5 this evening, my impression is it is 6 self-created. All of these variances are 7 self-created in some way. The issue becomes 8 whether it is relevant and determinative. 9 We had a lot of testimony here this evening 10 regarding how we got here. Perhaps there 11 was a misunderstanding of the interpretation 12 of code at the county level or agriculture 13 level. I don't know what to add to that. 14 Peter, do you have anything to add? 15 MR. OLYMPIA: 16 No, I don't. I don't have the history 17 of this. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 Each applicant should be evaluated on 20 its own merit. 21 MR. OLYMPIA: 22 I have nothing. 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 Mr. McKelvey? 1 56 2 MR. McKELVEY: 3 No. 4 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 5 Mr. Levin? 6 MR. LEVIN: 7 No. 8 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 9 Mr. Masten? 10 MR. MASTEN: 11 No. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 Mr. Marino? 14 MR. MARINO: 15 No. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 Normally at this point I would ask for 18 a motion for approval, but I will also 19 remind the board that we have 62 days to 20 render a decision on this. This one as I 21 say for me was difficult and very involved 22 so that being said, I will look to the board 23 for their pleasure. 24 MR. MARINO: 1 57 2 Why would we delay it 62 days? What 3 are we looking to find out? What is it we 4 need to know that we don't know now? 5 MR. DONOVAN: 6 At this stage we have closed the 7 public hearings. It's not the time to ask 8 for additional information because the 9 public couldn't comment on it. The law 10 gives you 62 days. At this stage with the 11 public hearings are closed, the 62 days 12 would be to say, you know what, I'm really 13 not prepared to vote, I need some more time 14 to think about it. Alternatively, you can 15 say I don't need any more time because I'm 16 ready to vote. If you wanted to go home and 17 let it simmer in your mind, think about it 18 more before you vote. That's the only 19 reason. 20 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 21 It also gives us the opportunity to 22 review any meetings minutes from this 23 evening, to really evaluate the testimony 24 that we heard tonight. 1 58 2 MR. MARINO: 3 Could we put it off to next month's 4 meeting? 5 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 6 That's entirely possible. 7 MR. DONOVAN: 8 The law gives you 62 days. It doesn't 9 mean if you don't vote tonight you have to 10 wait 62 days. You need to vote within 62 11 days. 12 MR. MARINO: 13 Could I move that we put this off to 14 the October meeting and vote at that time? 15 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 16 You can if that is your motion. Do I 17 have a second? 18 MR. MASTEN: 19 I'll second it. 20 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 21 We have a motion from Mr. Marino and a 22 second from Mr. Masten to defer decision to 23 the October meeting. Roll call. Mr. Levin? 24 MR. LEVIN: 1 59 2 Yes. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 Mr. Marino? 5 MR. MARINO: 6 Yes. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Mr. Masten? 9 MR. MASTEN: 10 Yes. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 Mr. McKelvey? 13 MR. McKELVEY: 14 Yes. 15 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 16 Mr. Olympia? 17 MR. OLYMPIA: 18 Yes. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 I agree as well. We have not rendered 21 a decision this evening. We will do our 22 best to render a decision in the October 23 meeting. 24 MS. PAULI: 1 60 2 Will you be looking for anything else 3 from me? Will it be wise for me to be here 4 that night? Will it be a public hearing? 5 MR. DONOVAN: 6 The public hearing is closed, so 7 there's no further information that's being 8 requested by the board. It's up to you, we 9 are here the fourth Thursday of every month 10 except we're here the Tuesday before 11 Thanksgiving. You are welcome to be here. 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 1 61 2 STATE OF NEW YORK ) 3 ) ss: 4 COUNTY OF ORANGE ) 5 6 7 I, PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO, a Shorthand 8 Reporter and Notary Public within and for 9 the State of New York, do hereby certify 10 that the foregoing is a true and accurate 11 record of the minutes having been 12 stenographically recorded by me and 13 transcribed under my supervision to the best 14 of my knowledge and belief. 15 16 17 18 19 X______________________________ 20 PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO 21 22 23 Dated: October 12, 2018 STATE OF NEW YORK : COUNTY OF ORANGE TOWN OF NEWBURGH ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X In the Matter of JASON MEMMELAR, (27-3-16) R-3 Zone 46 Sloane Road, Newburgh, New York - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X DATED: September 27, 2018 TIME: 8:15 p.m. PLACE: Town of Newburgh, New York 1496 Route 300 Newburgh, New York 12550 Patrick DeGiorgio, Court Reporter BOARD MEMBERS: DARRIN SCALZO, Chairman PETER OLYMPIA JOHN McKELVEY RICHARD LEVIN JOHN MASTEN ANTHONY MARINO DARRELL BELL (Not Present) ALSO PRESENT: DAVID DONOVAN, ESQ. GERALD CANFIELD SIOBHAN JABLESNIK - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - MICHELLE L. CONERO PMB #276 56 North Plank Road - Suite 1 Newburgh, New York 12550 (845) 451-4163 1 2 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Our final item on the agenda this 4 evening is Jason Memmelar, 46 Sloan Road, 5 Newburgh (27-3-16) R-3 Zone. 6 Variance. Seeking an area variance to 7 keep an existing covered front porch (23 8 feet by 8 feet) with an existing 30.7 feet 9 in front, 11.4 feet on the side and combined 10 25 feet where 40 feet in the front, 15 feet 11 on the side and a combined 30 feet is 12 required. An area variance to keep an 13 existing deck (8 feet by 23 feet) with 14 existing 11.9 feet side yard and a combined 15 25.9 feet where 15 feet on the side and 16 total of 30 feet is required. Did I get 17 that right? 18 MS. JABLESNIK: 19 Yes. 20 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 21 The applicant sent out how many 22 letters? 23 MS. JABLESNIK: 24 58. 1 3 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 58. You are in second place tonight. 4 All mailings, publications, postings are in 5 order. If you could please introduce 6 yourself. 7 MR. MEMMELAR: 8 My name is Jason Memmelar. I'm the 9 owner of this house, 46 Sloane. I bought it 10 six, seven months ago and I was ready to 11 start working on it and said I don't think 12 this porch was built properly and it turns 13 out there was an area variance, it's too 14 close to the street and so I need an area 15 variance for that and then in the back there 16 is a door 10 feet high. There used to be a 17 deck there. From my understanding the 18 neighbors said that one of the ladies that 19 lived there burned her deck down somehow 20 with a grill. That's how it's not there 21 now. I'd like to put it back on. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Very good. Just to recap, what you 24 have on your front porch is a preexisting 1 4 2 nonconforming condition that you are seeking 3 an area variance for and the deck that you 4 are proposing to put on the back, will it be 5 the full width of the dwelling? 6 MR. MEMMELAR: 7 I would like to. 8 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 9 And it will stick out eight feet? 10 MR. MEMMELAR: 11 Yes. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 Stairs coming off it? 14 MR. MEMMELAR: 15 Yeah, off the back, like along the 16 deck, but not like into the side yards 17 getting closer to the property line. It 18 will just be further back. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 Very good. Thank you. I'll turn to 21 the board. Any questions? Mr. Olympia? 22 MR. OLYMPIA: 23 No. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 5 2 Mr. McKelvey? 3 MR. McKELVEY: 4 Any other houses that close to the 5 road? 6 MR. MEMMELAR: 7 Mine may be the closest, but maybe by 8 two feet. 9 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 10 Obviously it's a neighborhood, so it's 11 the character of the neighborhood. 12 MR. McKELVEY: 13 It's been there. 14 MR. MEMMELAR: 15 Yeah. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 Mr. Levin? 18 MR. LEVIN: 19 No questions. 20 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 21 Mr. Masten? 22 MR. MASTEN: 23 No. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 6 2 Mr. Marino? 3 MR. MARINO: 4 The improvement on the house would be 5 an asset to the community. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 I would agree. 8 MR. LEVIN: 9 I agree. 10 MR. McKELVEY: 11 The shed will be going? 12 MR. MEMMELAR: 13 The shed will be gone, yes. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 I would like to open the meeting up to 16 the members of the public? Anyone? Mr. 17 Canfield? 18 MR. CANFIELD: 19 One point of interest. You mentioned 20 the steps and I believe the applicant said 21 they were coming off the side of the deck. 22 MR. MEMMELAR: 23 Off the back. 24 MR. CANFIELD: 1 7 2 In any event, stairs are exempt from 3 the side yard requirements. 4 MR. MEMMELAR: 5 Good to know. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 Thank you. Hearing no other comments 8 from the public, I'll go to the board one 9 last time. 10 MR. OLYMPIA: 11 Fine. 12 MR. McKELVEY: 13 No. 14 MR. LEVIN: 15 No. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 May I hear a motion to close public 18 hearing? 19 MR. LEVIN: 20 I'll make a motion to close the public 21 hearing. 22 MR. MASTEN: 23 I'll second. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 8 2 We have a motion from Mr. Levin, a 3 second from Mr. Masten. Roll call. Mr. 4 Levin? 5 MR. LEVIN: 6 Yes. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Mr. Marino? 9 MR. MARINO: 10 Yes. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 Mr. Masten? 13 MR. MASTEN: 14 Yes. 15 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 16 Mr. McKelvey? 17 MR. McKELVEY: 18 Yes. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 Mr. Olympia? 21 MR. OLYMPIA: 22 Yes. 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 And I will say yes as well. Thank 1 9 2 you. We will try to render a decision this 3 evening. 4 Before proceeding, the board will take 5 a short adjournment to confer with counsel 6 regarding any questions raised by tonight's 7 applications. If I could ask in the 8 interest of time if you folks can wait out 9 in the hallway, we will call you back as 10 soon as we can. Thank you very much. 11 12 (Time noted 8:15 p.m.) 13 14 (Decision: Time Resumed 8:45 p.m.) 15 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 Our final item for the evening is 18 Jason Memmelar, 46 Sloan Road, Newburgh 19 (27-3-16) R-3 Zone seeking an area variance 20 to keep an existing covered front porch (23 21 feet by 8 feet) with an existing 30.7 feet 22 in front, 11.4 feet on the side and combined 23 25 feet where 40 feet in the front, 15 feet 24 on the side and a combined 30 feet is 1 10 2 required. An area variance to keep an 3 existing deck (8 feet by 23 feet) with 4 existing 11.9 feet side yard and a combined 5 25.9 feet where 15 feet on the side and 6 total of 30 feet is required. 7 Does the board have any further 8 discussion on this applicant? Therefore, 9 first criteria is whether or not the benefit 10 can be achieved by other means feasible to 11 the applicant? The front yard is a 12 pre-existing nonconforming. The rear deck 13 appears to be in kind with what perhaps used 14 to be there, so I would say that's good. 15 Second, if there's an undesirable change in 16 the neighborhood character or a detriment to 17 nearby properties? It doesn't appear so. 18 MR. McKELVEY: 19 No. 20 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 21 Third, whether the request is 22 substantial? Again, it doesn't appear so. 23 Fourth, whether the request will have an 24 adverse physical or environmental effect? 1 11 2 Does not appear so. Fifth, whether the 3 alleged difficulty is self-created? This is 4 relative but not determinative whether it's 5 preexisting and nonconforming and not 6 self-created. The deck is going to be in 7 line with the current structure so I would 8 say no. I look to the board for a motion. 9 MR. LEVIN: 10 I make a motion to approve. 11 MR. McKELVEY: 12 Second. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Motion from Mr. Levin, I have a second 15 from Mr. McKelvey. Roll call, Mr. Levin? 16 MR. LEVIN: 17 Yes. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 Mr. Marino? 20 MR. MARINO: 21 Yes. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 Mr. Masten? 24 MR. MASTEN: 1 12 2 Yes. 3 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 4 Mr. McKelvey? 5 MR. McKELVEY: 6 Yes. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Mr. Olympia? 9 MR. OLYMPIA: 10 Yes. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 I vote yes as well. Motion is 13 carried. You are good to go. 14 That concludes our meeting for this 15 evening. Do we have meeting minutes to 16 approve? Yes, we do. I will look to the 17 board for approval of last month's meeting 18 minutes. 19 MR. MASTEN: 20 I make a motion. 21 MR. MARINO: 22 Second. 23 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 24 Motion from Mr. Masten, second from 1 13 2 Mr. Marino. All in favor? 3 4 (Board in Favor) 5 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 That concluded the meeting. Motion to 8 adjourn? 9 MR. McKELVEY: 10 Motion to adjourn. 11 MR. MASTEN: 12 Second. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 Motion to adjourn from Mr. McKelvey, 15 second from Mr. Masten. All in favor? 16 17 (Board in favor) 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 1 14 2 STATE OF NEW YORK ) 3 ) ss: 4 COUNTY OF ORANGE ) 5 6 7 I, PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO, a Shorthand 8 Reporter and Notary Public within and for 9 the State of New York, do hereby certify 10 that the foregoing is a true and accurate 11 record of the minutes having been 12 stenographically recorded by me and 13 transcribed under my supervision to the best 14 of my knowledge and belief. 15 16 17 18 19 X______________________________ 20 PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO 21 22 23 Dated: October 12, 2018 STATE OF NEW YORK : COUNTY OF ORANGE TOWN OF NEWBURGH ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X In the Matter of Carol Pick, (73-11-6) R-3 Zone 17 Hill Road, Newburgh, New York - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X DATED: September 27, 2018 TIME: 8:10 p.m. PLACE: Town of Newburgh, New York 1496 Route 300 Newburgh, New York 12550 Patrick DeGiorgio, Court Reporter BOARD MEMBERS: DARRIN SCALZO, Chairman PETER OLYMPIA JOHN McKELVEY RICHARD LEVIN JOHN MASTEN ANTHONY MARINO DARRELL BELL (Not Present) ALSO PRESENT: DAVID DONOVAN, ESQ. GERALD CANFIELD SIOBHAN JABLESNIK - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - MICHELLE L. CONERO PMB #276 56 North Plank Road - Suite 1 Newburgh, New York 12550 (845) 451-4163 1 2 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Our next applicant is Carol Pick, 17 4 Hill Road, Newburgh, area variance to keep 5 an accessory building (10 feet by 12 feet) 6 in a front yard (has two front yards Hill 7 Run Road and Wall Street-Paper Road). 8 Applicant sent out how many letters? 9 MS. JABLESNIK: 10 89. 11 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 12 You are the winner for this hearing. 13 All the mailings, publications, postings are 14 in order. Miss Pick, if you could just give 15 us a run down on what it is you are looking 16 for. 17 MS. PICK: 18 When I purchased the property in 2012 19 there was a small shed in the backyard. It 20 was 8 by 8. And I found out recently that 21 it didn't have a permit from the previous 22 owners. I call it a plywood shed because it 23 was just basically plywood and it wasn't 24 holding up to the weather very well so it 1 3 2 was beginning to rot at the bottom and so 3 forth. My husband is selling his house in 4 New Windsor. He had a newer shed that is in 5 pristine condition and I came to the town 6 and asked for a permit to demolish the 7 smaller shed and to replace it with the 8 larger one. My permit was denied. I was 9 told there is this Paper Street behind there 10 so my backyard is a front yard so I have two 11 front yards. I'm asking for the variance to 12 have the newer shed. It's on the footprint 13 of the old one. It's set back the exact 14 amount that it's supposed to be. And so I'm 15 just hoping that you will grant a variance. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 Thank you. As I say we have all 18 visited the site so we have seen it. I saw 19 your posting of your notification out in 20 front and I believe I also saw one on the 21 back fence. 22 MS. PICK: 23 I was told that I had to. From the 24 trees in the back, I'm sure all the 1 4 2 squirrels will read it. 3 THE HEARING OFFICER: 4 I was going to ask how many people 5 went and read that sign? 6 MS. PICK: 7 That was the regulation, I had to have 8 one in the front and one in the back on Wall 9 Street. 10 THE HEARING OFFICER: 11 We appreciate you following the rules. 12 MS. PICK: 13 I'm trying. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 Any questions from the board? 16 MR. OLYMPIA: 17 I have none. 18 MR. McKELVEY: 19 I think she did everything that was 20 required. 21 THE HEARING OFFICER: 22 Mr. Levin? 23 MR. LEVIN: 24 None. 1 5 2 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 3 Mr. Masten? 4 MR. MASTEN: 5 None. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 Mr. Marino? 8 MR. MARINO: 9 Nothing. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 I now open this to members of the 12 public. Anybody like to speak on this 13 application? Hearing none, one last 14 opportunity from the board. 15 MR. OLYMPIA: 16 I'm fine. 17 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 18 May I hear a motion from the board to 19 close the public hearing? 20 MR. McKELVEY: 21 I'll make a motion. 22 MR. LEVIN: 23 I'll second. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 6 2 Motion from Mr. McKelvey, a second 3 from Mr. Masten. Roll call. Mr. Levin? 4 MR. LEVIN: 5 Yes. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 Mr. Marino? 8 MR. MARINO: 9 Yes. 10 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 11 Mr. Masten? 12 MR. MASTEN: 13 Yes. 14 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 15 Mr. McKelvey? 16 MR. McKELVEY: 17 Yes. 18 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 19 Mr. Olympia? 20 MR. OLYMPIA: 21 Yes. 22 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 23 And I vote yes as well. Public 24 hearing is closed and we will try our best 1 7 2 to render a decision this evening. 3 4 (Time noted 8:10 p.m.) 5 6 (Decision: Time Resumed 8:40 p.m.) 7 8 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 9 Our fourth applicant for the evening 10 was Carol Pick, 17 Hill Road, Newburgh, area 11 variance to keep an accessory building (10 12 feet by 12 feet) in a front yard (has two 13 front yards Hill Run Road and Wall 14 Street-Paper Road). 15 The property has two front yards, Hill 16 Run Road and Wall Street which is an 17 unapproved street. Any discussion from the 18 board? Hearing none, we will weigh the 19 criteria. First one being whether or not 20 the benefit can be achieved by other means 21 feasible to the applicant? Not with the 22 Paper Street behind, I don't see that being 23 possible. Second, if there is an 24 undesirable change in the neighborhood 1 8 2 character or a detriment to nearby 3 properties. 4 MR. McKELVEY: 5 It's in the same spot. 6 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 7 It's a little larger from what I 8 understand, but not substantial. The third, 9 whether the request is substantial. I don't 10 believe it is. 11 MR. McKELVEY: 12 No. 13 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 14 The fourth is whether the request will 15 have adverse physical or environmental 16 effects? I don't believe so. 17 MR. McKELVEY: 18 No. 19 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 20 Fifth, whether the alleged difficulty 21 is self-created, this is relative, not 22 determinative. Of course it's self-created 23 because the home is on a street that as two 24 front yards. So, that being said, I will 1 9 2 look to the board for a motion. 3 MR. LEVIN: 4 I'll make a motion to approve. 5 MR. OLYMPIA: 6 I'll second. 7 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 8 Motion from Mr. Levin, second from Mr. 9 Olympia. Roll call. Mr. Levin? 10 MR. LEVIN: 11 Yes. 12 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 13 Mr. Marino? 14 MR. MARINO: 15 Yes. 16 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 17 Mr. Masten? 18 MR. MASTEN: 19 Yes. 20 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 21 Mr. McKelvey? 22 MR. McKELVEY: 23 Yes. 24 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 1 10 2 Mr. Olympia? 3 MR. OLYMPIA: 4 Yes. 5 CHAIRMAN SCALZO: 6 I vote yes. The motion is carried, 7 the application is approved. 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 1 11 2 STATE OF NEW YORK ) 3 ) ss: 4 COUNTY OF ORANGE ) 5 6 7 I, PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO, a Shorthand 8 Reporter and Notary Public within and for 9 the State of New York, do hereby certify 10 that the foregoing is a true and accurate 11 record of the minutes having been 12 stenographically recorded by me and 13 transcribed under my supervision to the best 14 of my knowledge and belief. 15 16 17 18 19 X______________________________ 20 PATRICK M. DeGIORGIO 21 22 23 Dated: October 12, 2018 24